Innovation Anchored in Tradition:
Action Research @ Glendale Community College

Project Links:
Home
What is PAR?
Proposal
Timeline
Literature Review
Cycle One
Cycle Two
Cycle Three
Reflection on '04-'05

Future Cycles

Michael Dulay

The following transcript is captures a discussion I had with one of my students via synchronous online discussion. I was working in a coffee shop in Santa Monica, and she was at home in Glendale.


AIM IM with takenanachan.
5/3/05, 5:04 PM
takenanachan: hi mikesan, this is nanami from your class
takenanachan: are you busy now?
Michael Dulay: Hello
Michael Dulay: Nanami
Michael Dulay: how are you?
5:05 PM
takenanachan: I'm fine thank you. And yourself?
Michael Dulay: I'm actually at a coffee shop getting ready to respond to your emails
Michael Dulay: I can read them while we chat if you like?
takenanachan: Yes, that sounds good.
Michael Dulay: ok
Michael Dulay: let me open the one on Piaget
takenanachan: Ok
takenanachan: Can I go get coffee,too?
Michael Dulay: sure
Michael Dulay: are you at a starbucks?
takenanachan: No, I just got home and I need to make coffee
Michael Dulay: ahhh
Michael Dulay: I was going to ask if you wanted to meet
Michael Dulay: so, tell me what did I just do?
Michael Dulay: did I take the information that you gave me: about making coffee
takenanachan: yes
Michael Dulay: and assimilate it? or did I make an effort to accomodate it?
takenanachan: you assimilated what I said?
Michael Dulay: true
Michael Dulay: what schema was I susing
Michael Dulay: *using
takenanachan: your schema was that people go get coffee at starbucks?
Michael Dulay: YES!
Michael Dulay:
Michael Dulay: good
takenanachan:
Michael Dulay: so by telling me you had to make it
Michael Dulay: I accomodated
Michael Dulay: right?
takenanachan: right.
takenanachan: so
5:10 PM
takenanachan: wait im confused.
Michael Dulay: how?
Michael Dulay: because both processes happened?
takenanachan: yes
Michael Dulay: that's ok
Michael Dulay: the first was because I was not asking enough info
Michael Dulay: I assumed to make my judgement easier
Michael Dulay: that is assimilation
takenanachan: oh ok then after you heard me saying that i have to make coffee,
takenanachan: you accomodated the new info
Michael Dulay: yes!
takenanachan: ok
Michael Dulay: so that not all people using IM drink coffee at coffee shops
Michael Dulay: I had to use more cognitive effort
Michael Dulay: now your turn...
Michael Dulay: give me an example of assimilation in your day today
takenanachan: Let me think...
takenanachan: I went to work today at elementary school
5:15 PM
takenanachan: and when I was teaching how to do origami to little kids
takenanachan: and one of my kids took more origami paper than he was supposed to. and i assumed, since
he is always making trouble, he just wanted to take more paper so everyone else had less than him
takenanachan: but t
takenanachan: then, he later came up to me and asked me he wanted to make a box for his mom and
dad ,too. so he needed more paper
Michael Dulay: great example!
takenanachan: and i accomodated a new schema?
Michael Dulay: I'm not sure
Michael Dulay: do you think of him differently now?
takenanachan: yeah, i didnt know he could be so thoughtful for other people
Michael Dulay: so does he represent a schema of a "bully"
Michael Dulay: or trouble maker?
5:20 PM
takenanachan: i thought him of t
takenanachan: troublemaker before
Michael Dulay: where is now- what schema is he in?
takenanachan: mmmm... i think i was only focusing on his troublemaker side, but now i see him a nice boy
who likes his parents
Michael Dulay: did you actually change a schema?
Michael Dulay: or just move him into a different one?
takenanachan: i think i just move him int
Michael Dulay: good
takenanachan: so
Michael Dulay: so with more information, you were able to think more complexly?
takenanachan: yes
Michael Dulay: would you say this was also a lesson in concepts?
takenanachan: yes
Michael Dulay: you defined a formal concept as one with rules
Michael Dulay: so you have rules for each schema?
Michael Dulay: and schema are the same as categories?
takenanachan: yes.
5:25 PM
Michael Dulay: good
Michael Dulay: so how does a person acquire schema and categories?
Michael Dulay: I mean-- at what age does it begin?
takenanachan: mmmm
takenanachan: i forgot
Michael Dulay: that's ok
Michael Dulay: when do poeple begin to use language ans symbols?
takenanachan: from age 2?
Michael Dulay: in the preoperational stage, right?
takenanachan: right
Michael Dulay: so is language a way to label the world?
takenanachan: yes
Michael Dulay: can the child in the preoperational stage focus on all types of information?
Michael Dulay: or are there limits?
takenanachan: they are limited. they cant understand abstract words
Michael Dulay: good
Michael Dulay: why not?
5:30 PM
takenanachan: because those words are not visible or touchable.
Michael Dulay: yes
Michael Dulay: so when can they make this shift to more complex thinking?
Michael Dulay: to abstract ideas
takenanachan: when they grow up into formal operation stage
Michael Dulay: how does this relate to funcitonal fixedness?
takenanachan: what do you mean by functional fixedness?
Michael Dulay: or mental set?
takenanachan: oh,
Michael Dulay: in your essay, you describe them as processes that interupt problem solving
takenanachan: they can see one object or situation in many aspects?
Michael Dulay: another way of saying that is de-centration, right?
takenanachan: right
Michael Dulay: so why do people experience this problems so often?
Michael Dulay: *these
5:35 PM
Michael Dulay: (the * is a way of correcting spelling)
takenanachan: ok
Michael Dulay: so why do people experience these problems so often?
takenanachan: mmmm
takenanachan: i dont know.
Michael Dulay: that's ok
takenanachan: because of the environment?
Michael Dulay: think about why children engage in centration
Michael Dulay: there are too few schema in their minds, right?
takenanachan: right
takenanachan: they dont have much info
Michael Dulay: then why would adults do the same
Michael Dulay: even though they have de-centrated already?
takenanachan: because they believe t
takenanachan: their schema
Michael Dulay: perhaps
takenanachan: ?
Michael Dulay: also because they are lazy?
Michael Dulay: and the are in an environment where there is too much info?
Michael Dulay: look around your room
takenanachan: ok
Michael Dulay: are there many things thatmight engage your mind
Michael Dulay: and make you think?
Michael Dulay: or is it very simple?
Michael Dulay: or look in your purse?
Michael Dulay: or at the college?
5:40 PM
takenanachan: there are too many things and i dont even pay attention to think
Michael Dulay: that's right
Michael Dulay: is the learned?
Michael Dulay: I want to connect to learning theory also
takenanachan: so the reason adults do the same thing is because they have too much info?
Michael Dulay: partially
Michael Dulay: but I would argue
Michael Dulay: that it is...
Michael Dulay: becuase they do not know how they think
Michael Dulay: or why they think
Michael Dulay: or how they've learned to think
Michael Dulay: are we encouraged to slow down and examine everything in our world?
takenanachan: no
Michael Dulay: so how does reinforcement play into this?
takenanachan: im lost
Michael Dulay: that's ok
Michael Dulay: I was trying to make a broad connection
Michael Dulay: we'll find our way out
Michael Dulay: and not be lost
5:45 PM
takenanachan: thank you
Michael Dulay: does reinforcement increase behavior?
takenanachan: yes
Michael Dulay: so is stopping to look at every sign on a bulletin board a behavior?
takenanachan: yes
Michael Dulay: so if you stopped to read everything on a bulletin board, what is the consequence that you
most often experience?
Michael Dulay: pos. reinforcement, negitve reinforcement, or punishment?
takenanachan: pos reinforcement
Michael Dulay: from who?
Michael Dulay: that is, who is reinforcing your efforts to read everything?
takenanachan: yourself
Michael Dulay: interesting
Michael Dulay: how do your reinforce yourself?
Michael Dulay: *you
takenanachan: because if im trying to find some info im looking for on the board, and i find it myself, i keep
stopping to look at the board.
5:50 PM
Michael Dulay: good.
Michael Dulay: but do you always have time?
takenanachan: no
Michael Dulay: so is time an external factor
takenanachan: yes,
Michael Dulay: that is manifested in your watch, friends, etc.?
takenanachan: yes
Michael Dulay: so do your friends, watch, etc. reinforce your looking at everything on the board?
Michael Dulay: in your day to day expereinces?
takenanachan: i think it depends
Michael Dulay: good
Michael Dulay: on the importance of what you are looking for?
takenanachan: yes
Michael Dulay: my point is this...
Michael Dulay: should people be under the control of the environment?...
Michael Dulay: because if they are, and their behaviors are regulated...
Michael Dulay: then does their mind change eventually?
5:55 PM
takenanachan: if people are under the control of the same environmet, their mind stick on a certain way, but
if the environment around them changes, so do thier minds
Michael Dulay: good
Michael Dulay: so repeated behaviors lead to mind changes?
Michael Dulay: I ask this because one environment change does not cause a mind change (i.e.,
accomodation)
takenanachan: ok
Michael Dulay: for example, moving to the US from Japan
takenanachan: so,
Michael Dulay: go ahead...
takenanachan: if the behaivores repeated, dont they strengthen the way of thinking?
6:00 PM
Michael Dulay: yes, but could that mean less thinking?
Michael Dulay: like hearing a song again and again
Michael Dulay: do you have to think about hte words after the 100th time?
takenanachan: you dont even think why you behave that way?
Michael Dulay: yes
Michael Dulay: that is where functional fixedness and mental set come from
takenanachan: i think i understand
Michael Dulay: good
Michael Dulay: do you see the relationship between learning theory (i.e., reinforcement) and cognitive
psychology that I was trying to make?
takenanachan: yes
Michael Dulay:
Michael Dulay: good
Michael Dulay: I tried to include material from both your emails in this duscussion
Michael Dulay: I hope it helped
takenanachan: it did!
Michael Dulay: I'm glad
takenanachan: thank you do much
Michael Dulay: The error correction on the exam will probably be related to learning theory and behaviorism
takenanachan: ok
Michael Dulay: Please review those notes, and let me know if you have Qs
Michael Dulay: questions
6:05 PM
Michael Dulay: I have to go-- do you have other questions?
takenanachan: not for now.
Michael Dulay: ok
takenanachan: thank you!
Michael Dulay: I'll see you tomorrow
takenanachan: ok take care!
Michael Dulay: you're welcome
Michael Dulay: you too
Michael Dulay: bye
takenanachan: bye
You left the chat.


Glendale Community College - 1500 N. Verdugo Road - Glendale, CA 91208

Site created on August 10, 2004